Most of the Merchant Providers are already collection 1.99% for rupay cc on upi qr on payment of more than 2000.
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Demand for RuPay credit cards surpasses Visa & Mastercard on Tier 2, 3, 4 cities
- Thread starter Abhishek012
- Start date
dvader
TF Premier
They have to or it's a non-viable system. I don't want RuPay to just stay in India. However, being in control and being directly influenced by the government is a major concern in the long term. Governments come and go and Payment/Card systems provide an easy way to make extra cash. For RuPay to not become another Patanjali the best way is to globalize it and remove the direct influence of (any) government from it (It should be under RBI regulations OFC). Indian Financial Tech Rupay/UPI etc are some of the best non-capitalist solutions in the world aimed at actually helping commoners. I hope it grows not because it's Indian, but because of its vision and goals.
I would also welcome the initiative to onboard Visa and Mastercard on UPI albeit at some nominal fee that goes to the Republic of India. This sends a message all over the world that we not only encourage competition but take it head on.
visa mastercard wont come on upi in india its buinsess would go down the drain.
because merchants wont be ready to give 2.5-3.5% mdr on upi and with the loopholes they will b draining money and cant be able to sustain their rewards system.
a lot of work needs to be done to make this a sustainable proposition
this was working for rupay because it was an npo company but it wont for visa mc.
and rupay going global has very good chances due to upi being in demand
but i dont think foreign countries card users would prefer rupay over amex diners visa mc for a pos transaction given thier better rewards prposition their
dvader
TF Premier
Again the profitability is not anyone's concern but Visa/MC/Amex's. What I was referring to is making the system open and making efforts to making it global. India is a unique demographic. Maybe Visa lowers its fee to tap into the sheer quantity of txns and profit from the economy of scale or maybe it allows UPI in other countries. Remember the world is not just the USA and Europe. In the coming decades Africa, Southeast Asia, and Eastern Europe could see rapid growth and RuPay/UPI could be a ticket to financial freedom for these countries.
USA and Europe is evolving too in that they are more open to new tech these days. If a payment system offers lower fee for merchants they might prefer it. It will be a slow and long process but denying it would be premature.
rupay can conquer borders as it isnt targeting profits
its whole buinsess is built on mdr on transactions model not sure why would they want to change course when they are minting billions using this
as i said rupay will reach corners due to upi demand but visa mc on rupay is something visa and mc people need to plan out to make it sustainable
dvader
TF Premier
Yes, and the Idea that RuPay should drive out other card companies is as toxic as RuPay not being adopted. Checks and balances. Visa/MC/Other Card companies evolving and changing themselves and coexisting with RuPay is the better sustainable path. I Don't See RuPay/UPI without any govt influence in the coming years so the best approach would be for other countries adopting similar tech and for existing organizations to evolve themselves to these new scenarios. I am referring to a wider phenomenon in that, UPI and RuPay might not go full global in their current form but instead influence other countries to build similar systems and then connect these systems together, like SWIFT on steroids. Visa/MC/AMEX won't go anywhere no matter what but they can be forced to evolve. and this force won't be one of brute force but the positive force of social change.
Also, Indian banks posted the best NPA stats in decades. I hope their greed with RuPay CC on UPI doesn't come back to bite them. Strict control on churning/rotating or else it would be like "just because of few bastards we loose a good thing"
Also, Indian banks posted the best NPA stats in decades. I hope their greed with RuPay CC on UPI doesn't come back to bite them. Strict control on churning/rotating or else it would be like "just because of few bastards we loose a good thing"
Abhishek012
TF Pioneer
MDR is same for all Visa/master/RuPay credit cards (except Amex).
RuPay Credit card is never link with UPI, "Credit on UPI" is direct link with our credit account/funding account.
RuPay Credit card link with UPI is just a marketing gimmick and nothing else.
UPI has its own payment system and settlement system and that's why recently Credit line on UPI launched.
Pata nahi kon tha woh jisne yeh fake rumours failaya ki RuPay me MDR kam lagta hai aur visa/mastercard me jada (Credit card k mamle me). 🤣🤣
Yes, debit card me RuPay me kam MDR hai but woh bhi Classic variant me only aur recently govt ne jo zero MDR kiya woh sirf debit card k liye hai.
MDR fees are actually decided by neither the card networks nor the banks. Payment gateway companies decide, banks also have their own gateways but they are a separate department of the bank, and not the bank directly decides the MDR charges.
When you registered on any online gateway sites like PayU, Billdesk, Razorpay, Phonepe, Paytm, Cashfree etc or offline POS machine issuer companies like Paytm, Bharatpe, Pineplabs, Innoviti etc, Do they ever say or mentioned anywhere that Visa/mastercard Credit Card will charge more than RuPay Credit Card ? 🤣🤣 Ofcourse not.
Who collect the MDR from merchant ? Online payment gateway companies or offline POS machine issuer companies.
Pata nahi saare Indians ko konsa kida kaata hai, jo sochte hai Visa/mastercard Credit Card k MDR jada hai RuPay credit card se.
Dnt believe me, go and talk to payment gateway companies and come back and tell me, I spoke to a payment gateway company which charged more on Visa/mastercard credit card and less charge on RuPay credit cards. This will never happen, MDR charges is same for all Visa/master/RuPay credit cards (except Amex).
Ofcourse, different payment gateways charge different MDR. for example - Pinelabs charge lowest MDR approx 1.5% for Visa/master/RuPay credit cards and Paytm mostly charge 1.99% for Visa/master/RuPay credit cards. If you negotiate with Paytm then maybe MDR charges will be reduced to 1.75% but this 1.75% MDR will be applicable for Visa/master/RuPay credit cards. Paytm or any other companies will never offer you less MDR on RuPay credit cards and high MDR on Visa/mastercard credit card.
And last, "Credit on UPI" MDR charges is also same as Visa/master/RuPay credit cards except one thing, "Credit on UPI" is free for under 2k transaction for small merchants.
@dvader
aree bhai mein rupay cc on upi mein mdr ki baat kar raha tha
pos mein same hai mujhe bhi pata hai
but how many people have you seen using a rupay on pos
jo bhi rupay cc le raha hai simply upi ke liye use kar raha hai
it is still not the first preference of indians its the backup in case merchants dont have a pos
pos mein same hai mujhe bhi pata hai
but how many people have you seen using a rupay on pos
jo bhi rupay cc le raha hai simply upi ke liye use kar raha hai
it is still not the first preference of indians its the backup in case merchants dont have a pos
souvikr
TF Premier
I am thinking who removed the grammatical errors from these two Wikipedia pages? 🤣🤣
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Abhishek012
TF Pioneer
rupay cc on upi/CC on UPI ka bhi maine bola MDR same hai, jo Visa/master/RuPay credit cards k hai.
sirf itna sa alag hai ki under 2k transaction tak merchant k liye MDR Free hai CC on UPI ka.
Aur actual me kitna MDR wasool karna hai woh Phonepe, paytm, gpay, bharatpe jaisi companies decide karta hai.
Like phonepe grocery me 1.3% MDR leta hai, Bharatpe electronic pe 1.25% MDR and GPay toh 2.35% MDR deta hai - CC on UPI/Visa/master/RuPay credit cards se.
Dusre category me 1.5%, 1.75%, 1.9%, 2.0% MDR bhi hai. But sab ka MDR same hoga, jo bhi category me jo company wasool karega chahe - CC on UPI/Visa/master/RuPay credit cards k liye ho.
Payment kisse kiye hai usme koi bhedbhaw nahi hota hai.
Abhishek012
TF Pioneer
Kabhi wikipedia me kuch edit ya add kiye ho. khud he pata chal jayega.
Maine toh NPCI INTERNATIONAL PAYMENTS LIMITED k liye bhi ek alag sa Wikipedia page banaya tha.
Jispar lamba debate chala Wikipedia me sab k sath ki alag se page rakhna chhaiye ya nahi but last tak suna nahi unlogo ne aur NPCI wikipedia page me he merge kar diya saare info. 🤣🤣
souvikr
TF Premier
Nhi bhai iska jarurat nhi padha abhi tak. Itna gyan nhi hai mere paas 🤣
yeh to recently initiate hua hai pehle start mein banks ko loota hai sabne isliye i said to make this sustainable for pos and ecom it should be made as worthy in the eyes of a customer in comparison on amex visa mc
Abhishek012
TF Pioneer
Woh loota thorai hai, business hai woh. suruwati time me MDR Free hote hai, testing k liye trial period k time.
Jab 1980s me Visa Card enter kiya tha India me 10 saal se bhi jada MDR free tha India me.
Jab mastercard enter kiya tha India me tab bhi suruwati time me MDR free tha.
Jab RuPay debit card start hua MDR Free tha.
Jab RuPay Contactless start hua, approx 4 years MDR Free tha (yeh aise time ki baat kar raha hu jab govt ne zero MDR impose bhi nahi kiya tha).
Jab RuPay credit card start hua tha, isme bhi trial period me MDR free tha and phir RuPay debit card ka MDR lagta tha, dhire dhire RuPay credit card network build kiya and credit card ka MDR lagna start hua.
RuPay AutoPay ka bhi MDR abhi free hai, kyunki trial period me hai abhi. Jab officially live hota MDR impose karna chalu kar dega.
UPI International ka bhi MDR abhi free hai, abhi tak NPCI ne decide nhi kiya hai kitna MDR lagega, kuch circular me mentioned jarur hai but still almost free he hai.
Same "Credit card on UPI" ka and "Wallet UPI" bhi trail period me Free MDR tha, khud NPCI k circular me likha hua hai.
Yeh Business hai, kisi ko loota nahi hai. Aise business kam karta hai.
Kisi ne bank ko nahi loota. NPCI, banks k sath mil kar test kar rahe hai. Phir dhire dhire ek ek companies k sath tieup kar rahe hai and MDR laga rahe hai.
Jaise visa/mastercard ne banks k sath Free MDR de kar test kiye the suruwati dino me.
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dvader
TF Premier
This is well explained and this has been the norm since the advent of credit/debit cards when Diners Club first launched a cardboard card in 1950. This is a normal testing/trial practice. I for one am in support of MDR and any charges cuz then RuPay won't be a burden on Indian Taxpayers. But given that RuPay prioritizes financial freedom over profit/working cost (remember prioritizes) RuPay can afford to do things that Visa/MC wouldn't do unless someone shows them how it's done.
Abhishek012
TF Pioneer
My perspective is different. I support zero MDR on RuPay debit cards but only for govt scheme cards.
Govt scheme cards are Jan dhan yojna card, Kisan card, Mudra card, Pungrain card etc.
First understand why govt impose zero MDR ?
Short answer - Indian govt wants to help poor people, lower middle people and small merchants. Right ?
So, impose zero MDR on Govt scheme cards. It will help poor people to lower middle people and small merchants.
Apply MDR on remaining cards like RuPay Classic, Platinum and Select debit cards.
Govt scheme cards also have the name of the card type clearly mentioned on the front of the card and govt scheme card colors are also different. Therefore, small merchants will easily recognize that it's a govt scheme card. There will be no MDR charges on this card.
Also, govt website shouldn't charge MDR from customers, if customers use any RuPay debit cards (Some govt website charged extra fee from customers and before zero MDR, govt websites also charged this MDR fee from RuPay debit card customers).
There are lots of things we can do to help poor to rich people, small banks to big private banks, small merchants to big merchants and other 3rd party technology service providers etc and everyone will be happy.
Apart from this, if the govt wants, the govt will still give subsidies but it will be only for govt scheme cards. But its percentage is very less and presently, Indian govt still helps indirectly for govt scheme cards and banks.
dvader
TF Premier
I have no issues with govt subsidizing RuPay for govt schemes. Making sure that the restrictions and compliance are in place so that it doesn't get exploited by non-eligible entities.
Btw can someone start a thread on the looming unsecured credit crisis in Indian Banking? Just finished with the UBS report(s). I suspected this as Banks reported the lowest NPAs in a decade, they got greedy and partnered with every ba*#@rd in a metro city opening a fintech startup to give unsecured credit lines to anyone. I think a few private banks might have seen this in their books before UBS, (I mean they are not that dumb). Has any bank tried to decrease the unsecured credit limit(s) in their products? I mean I know it's impossible and unprecedented but a few less professional (chindi) banks would start doing this. As for PSUs; bye bye tax money.
@Abhishek012 what is your take on this?
the NPA crisis wouldnt start as of now.RBI has rung the alarm on unsecured personal loans but banks have indirect exposure to this via NBFCs as of now.
If the interest rate stagnates or cuts NPAs wouldnt be much of a crisis even though we enter a period of global reccesion as cost of living would have cooled down by then.
But if the economy shows resilience and rates remain elevated or increase then it would lead to a domino effect of NPAs for the banks as real wages arent increasing at the same rate compared to cost of living.If cost of living increases and real wages remain the same then yes Banks are going to feel the heat on their unsecured portfolio .probably arcs payday starts then
dvader
TF Premier
Btw I have a personal hatered towards NBFCs somehow. Something inside me just never trusted them. What is the general attitude towards NBFCs I mean as a whole not counting this situation.
Also, I feel that this is the best time to apply for credit cards for people who have spotless CIBIL in terms of payment history. Say a >3 year old credit history with > 4-5 entries. Cuz banks would still be a able to lend easily and this demographic is pretty responsible with their CCs.
ILFS and DHFL crisis have ruined NBFCs as an investment in the eyes of the investor. Covid was the best thing that happened to this sector as people needed funds and based on credit demand, NBFCS started getting money. Had the crisis continued without any intervention NBFCs would have been a dead industry.
Agreed,Banks are out there lending unsecured at a all time rate % wise of their portfolio.
