Cheque Fraud: Rs 180 -> Rs 75,000 cashed out. Original text was overwritten. Please read the details and help.

[Aniket]

Endorsement kya hota hai ? Bearer cheque se kya lena dena ?🤔 Next Question of Ritwik

@telescope bro ko tag karna bhul gaya tha unko bhi confusion tha, hope clear ho gaya usme hi?

 

[VasukiVasuki is verified member.]

1. Please read the doc carefully. Half of it is in Hindi. The bank claims no responsibility. Bank says that the cheque did not appear forged or overwritten.
2. It seems like bank hasn't mentioned the clause for ID verification for cheque > Rs 50,000.

Looks like Pnb is so poor to have Cheque light machine.where u can see if there is any erasing or paper is erased under light .

Bank must have cctv , match both if positive. U can try find out person..there must be someone who tipped for 180 rs thing

No layman can come and do it

 

[Aniket]

Endorsement kya hota hai ? Bearer cheque se kya lena dena ?🤔 Next Question of Ritwik

Haan toh aap hi samjha dete (uska question ka ans kar dete) 🤣 ki bas ritiwik kya puchega next uska fikar hai 🤣

 

[shivamk]

Please suggest Sir on how to proceed with this. Neither I nor the neighbor has filed lawsuits. Also, what could be the estimated costs?

You can ask the lawyer to quote cost for legal proceedings in the claim. The scammer or the bank, whosoever is deemed liable by the court will be asked to pay for it.

 

[Batman]

Look that passbook,
How does the person knows the a/c balance and he exactly wrote a cheque less than the balance amount.

Some internal banking fraud shit is going on within that pnb branch.

Report this case to RBI for sure. Fraud branch


@Batman which state is this?

Thank you for pointing that out. I thought the same and so I didn't mask that last transaction. It seems like internal fraud at this PNB branch, but it is too big of an accusation to make without proof.

Rajasthan, tiny Tier 3 town.

 

[shivamk]

@Batman go with a lawyer is what I would suggest. This way the court will ask the bank to present the cheque in court and judge will himself clearly see that forgery is done for sure.

Regarding lawyer recommendation, ask your friend in session court. He can help you with that.

 

[Aniket]

This is an awful incident that happened to a neighbor. I am adding details for you all to read. Some of this may sound silly and stupid, but I am stating facts as they are. Please read and help.

1. Scamster posed as Metlife Insurance employee who needed to collect "final installment" of Rs 180 from neighbor. He had accurate details of insurance policy. He visited neighbor's home to collect, but didn't accept cash. Payment could only be made by cashier's cheque.
2. Neighbor wrote a cashier's cheque of Rs 180. He clearly wrote the name, amount (text and number), date and signature in ball point pen.
3. The words on cheque were overwritten. Rs 180 -> Rs 75,000. Name, amount, date are changed. Signature is untouched. The cheque has some indication that words are overwritten. I mean, it is like how pencil is erased but some letters are somewhat visible.
4. Neighbor did not have positive pay facility. He received no call from the bank when cheque was cleared.
5. Complaint and escalations - Bank has taken no responsibility and shifted the blame completely on neighbor.
6. FIR not registered - Police has taken a complaint, but refused to register FIR.

I am attaching masked cheque here. Please take a look for yourselves and suggest possible measures. https://postimg.cc/CB0ykmW4. Note that the cheque might look torn, but it is in one peace.
I am willing to escalate to Nodal, Principal Nodal desk and RBI Ombudsman.

Also, I will push neighbor for FIR being registered - what are the grounds for FIR here?

Meanwhile, I have advised neighbor to keep that account empty.

@Batman I would suggest ki offical complaint daal dijye bank mein, police mein wagerah wagera...jo fraud huwa hai, disclose every lil information

Firh investigation hoga, CCTV photage toh hoga hi bank ke pass jab encash karne aaya hoga banda, also UV light mein check karega truncated cheque ko ya baaki koi methods toh purna rup se pata chal hi jayega over writing/tampered and forged kiya gaya hai...tab baaki ke actions concerned parties apne aap hi lega jo jo involved tha ye fraud mein...

 

[Batman]

You can ask the lawyer to quote cost for legal proceedings in the claim. The scammer or the bank, whosoever is deemed liable by the court will be asked to pay for it.

What I fear is that my neighbor will not proceed if there is a lot of hassle. He has a sick family member that needs full time care.

That is another reason I am taking onus upon myself to help him (as much as I can).
I am willing to do anything that can be done online. Offline and in person meetups (police, courts) is time consuming for me. I can still push the neighbor if there's high chances of success.

 

[Beyond]

I wanted to quote the comments here and reply to them, but there are too many. I am tagging all the people who asked questions or gave advice. Please read the below update and share your views.

1. Neighbor filled the cheque himself. It was a CROSS cheque. Cross was erased. @varun__goel_ @telescope
2. Neighbor had also signed on back of cheque and written policy number etc. All of that was erased, only signature remained visible.
3. MetLife employee details - Neighbor did not verify employee ID. Even if he did, it wouldn't have been difficult to have a fake ID. @Vasuki
4. Neighbor doesn't remember the pen he used. It could have been scammer's pen.
5. Written complaint done to bank, received their reply as well. I'm attaching it below. @sidp
6. CCTV footage available of the scammer. What to do with it? @Vishal4u2
7. The cheque was indeed encashed without taking ID of scammer. How do I proceed here? @newinnov
8. I have asked neighbor to tell the bank that cheque must not be destroyed or taken away. Any simple way to do it online? @sidp

Why Bank may be at fault -

1. Bank didn't ID or KYC the scammer, even though cheque was > Rs 50,000. I found this article that states this guideline. Could someone please help me find RBI guideline for the same? @newinnov @varun__goel_ @#aniket
2. Cheque appears overwritten, but how do I enforce that to the bank? Can RBI do that? @its_karan @VISHESH_BANSAL @ritwik2000

Attached Document: Reply from bank -

1. Please read the doc carefully. Half of it is in Hindi. The bank claims no responsibility. Bank says that the cheque did not appear forged or overwritten.
2. It seems like bank hasn't mentioned the clause for ID verification for cheque > Rs 50,000.

FIR -

1. Is there a way to file FIR for this online? I have taken the proof from neighbor, can file it on his behalf. Please share what you know. @dealminer
2. The charges stated (thanks to @Tejo ) are File 420: cheating and 467: forgery. Is there anything else that applies?

Legal route -

1. Legal route can be taken, but I'm thinking of doing that after RBI complaint. Or would people here recommend getting in touch with Lawyer ASAP? If yes, please suggest a lawyer also. @newinnov @shivamk

Possible insurance coverage -

1. Do we know of any banking instrument that provides insurance for such matters. I know neighbor doesn't have a Credit card.

----
In my next comment, I will comment on advice from Ramesh Babu sir.

- Better to file FIR offline, cops have knowledge of related crimes in the area. For laymen- FIR is just a signed written statement of incident. Just don't delay filing FIR by more than a few days of incident!
- In case bank did not take id, than it's highly probable that someone in bank is colluding with criminal. (Might be a poor assumption)
- Always hire a local area lawyer, never pay fees to a online lawyer. Because you will need a local lawyer anyway if suit is filed.
- Suit can be filed on Bank manager after giving 30 days notice. Hence, meet with him and ask prior help, and tell him clearly that we will take legal action.
- Ask your neighbor if he knows a lawyer/ most lawyers consult free with their past clients.

Parallel pursue financial actions as suggested by Mr Ramesh Babu.

 

[ritwik2000]

View attachment 54257

@ritwik2000 Bearer cheque matalab wo nahi hota ki if A/c payee na ho toh wo bearer rahegaa...bearer bhi apna account mein trf kara sakta hai us case mein, just 2 diagonally parallel lines se

Simply, payee blank ho ya payee ka name bhi hai aur sath mein or bearer ya last endorsement blank ho...usko kehte hain

Few examples: yaha bearer ko kaat de toh firh payee mein jiksa name likha rahega bas wahi encash kara sakta hai...View attachment 54258

Ya order cheque iss tarah, or order likha rahega, ye cheque jiska name rahega wo encash kara sakta hai, ya uske order anusar:
View attachment 54260

thanks bhai information ke liye. did not had much knowledge about things related to cheques. ap logo ke kripa se knowledge milta jaraha he.

 

[Beyond]

What I fear is that my neighbor will not proceed if there is a lot of hassle. He has a sick family member that needs full time care.

That is another reason I am taking onus upon myself to help him (as much as I can).
I am willing to do anything that can be done online. Offline and in person meetups (police, courts) is time consuming for me. I can still push the neighbor if there's high chances of success.

You cannot file FIR on his behalf for financial crimes. You lake locus and you are not victim.

 

[sidpsidp is verified member.]

.

1. Written complaint done to bank, received their reply as well. I'm attaching it below. @sidpI
2. have asked neighbor to tell the bank that cheque must not be destroyed or taken away. Any simple way to do it online? @sidp

This is just an excuse. Seems like a internal job considering all facts(leaked policy details, no ID taken, clear overwriting, cheque amount just below balance, sms not received)

Verbal direction wont help, all bank has fraud detection department, contact them and Circle head. Involve them & police to preserve the cheque. Else it might be scrapped. In physical verification under uv light the altercations will be even clearer. Ask them to contact with recorded line only( best is mail, recorded call, then whatsapp , ask him to record face to face conversation as well cuz I think it is internal job, bm is in on it)

1. CCTV footage available of the scammer. What to do with it? @Vishal4u2

Share it with police & bank to ID him.
In this case bank has liability not USER. Bank must return all money to USER and later file civil suit against fraudsters.

1. The cheque was indeed encashed without taking ID of scammer. How do I proceed here? @newinnov

There is difference in policy & law. I think I'd for 50k cheque is policy. Law requires 2L cheque. @its_karan would have better knowledge regarding this. But even if just policy, bank employee must obey it , else they can lose their job.

.
FIR -

1. Is there a way to file FIR for this online? I have taken the proof from neighbor, can file it on his behalf. Please share what you know. @dealminer
2. The charges stated (thanks to @Tejo ) are File 420: cheating and 467: forgery. Is there anything else that applies?

Charges can be added later. No issue. Ask police to direct bank to preserve cheque. You can involve sp. Contacts in Cyber crime department might help but this case won't be under their jurisdiction.

 

[dealminer]

It seems like internal fraud at this PNB branch, but it is too big of an accusation to make without proof.

from your end, you can report it to RBI, as common people like your neighbour and others similar to him can't even make it to RBI or don't know how to.
So you being the vigilant citizen, do your part that's what I suggest or this will go on and on and these parasites will feast on the hard-earned savings of a common man.

For E-FIR try the app RajCop Citizen, which looks similar to the app in our state.

 

[Aniket]

thanks bhai information ke liye.

Welcome 😁

did not had much knowledge about things related to cheques. ap logo ke kripa se knowledge milta jaraha he.

Sab yehe aake sikhte hain bro and sabko sab kuch pata nahi rehta na suru se hi 😁

Aayesi hi knowledge toh bhadta hai, sikhne aur sikhane se 😊

 

[Aniket]

@dealminer kya delete kar diye aap mentioned karke galti se haha react hogaya issi liye toh nahi?😐

 

[sidpsidp is verified member.]

What I fear is that my neighbor will not proceed if there is a lot of hassle. He has a sick family member that needs full time care.

That is another reason I am taking onus upon myself to help him (as much as I can).
I am willing to do anything that can be done online. Offline and in person meetups (police, courts) is time consuming for me. I can still push the neighbor if there's high chances of success.

It's not too much hassle. If you are confident and contact higher ups fast, it can be resolved fast. If someone is timid, they will ignore. Therefore involve sp, bank fraud detection, Circle head.
Rbi complaint is enough. Your primary focus now should be to preserve the cheque. That will make everything else easy.

 

[dealminer]

kya delete kar diye aap

nhi bhai kuch nhi kia delete.

 

[Aniket]

Aniket Bhai following you right now, just for all the hard work you do here which is not admired by the people here in the forum. 🤣 🤣

@dealminer Ok, thanks 😁
lekin isme "🤣" ka matalab, majak kar rahe hain?😂

Noob log apko dannt kr chup krwa dete accha nhi lgta. 😆

Kis ki itni majaal chup kara de? 😏

Jo jada bakbak kar raha tha constructive criticism karne se toh uska pura t****d bhi toh 🕊️ gaya 😂💀

 

[Aniket]

nhi bhai kuch nhi kia delete.

Haan jee nahi hai deleted, redirect main post 1, OP ke comment pe kar raha tha so laga wo delete ho chuka hai...just a misunderstanding! 😐

 

[sidpsidp is verified member.]

It's not too much hassle. If you are confident and contact higher ups fast, it can be resolved fast. If someone is timid, they will ignore. Therefore involve sp, bank fraud detection, Circle head.
Rbi complaint is enough. Your primary focus now should be to preserve the cheque. That will make everything else easy.

@Batman Contact 1800 1800 or 1800 2021(pnb fraud detection) talk to agent and tell him full incident and ask to preserve cheque first. And that you have suspicion that it might be internal job due to all the facts( leaked policy details, no ID taken, clear overwriting, cheque amount just below balance, sms not received) also tell them You have cctv recording of fraudster, ask bank to retrieve cctv record of who encashed it.
But I guess you can do it from registered mobile only.